When CNN host Alisyn Camerota asked Loesch why she would say that the media loved grieving white moms, Loesch responded, “Because it’s true” and then noted that shootings give news media wall-to-wall coverage. Camerota tried to argue that mass shootings weren’t ratings gold because viewers hate to watch grieving families who’ve lost loved ones to senseless violence.

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The most difficult portion of the interview to get through—it’s literally cringe-inducing—is hearing Loesch claim that the NRA has no responsibility in mass shootings; nor does it need to come to the table to help fix it. Watch below, and then let’s discuss where Loesch falls on a scale from Kellyanne Conway to Ann Coulter.