KING: It seems to me that we're heading way in the wrong direction. Let me say immediately and unequivocally that I have been saddened by the way stigma has been heaped on the heads of our Muslim brothers and sisters around the world, but especially in our country. While I stand opposed to any religious expression or justification of vio­lence, I know that most brothers and sisters who follow Islam want peace, and love truth and justice just as much as the rest of us. I also know that the terrorists that we were concerned about for much of our history as a people bowed their knees to Jesus, not Allah. They burned the religious symbol of the cross on our lawns, and into the American collective unconscious. They dressed in cowards' garb when they donned white sheets to purify their das­tardly and evil deeds. They hid behind God's name to wreak havoc and terror on black people through lynching, castration, rape and social and political intimidation. So when I think of terror, I don't think first of Al Qaeda; I think of the Ku Klux Klan and other white hate groups that have perverted and recruited a warped Christian theology in the service of truth. As for the war in Iraq, I think it is on par with Viet­nam as a tragic misuse of American might and a misled campaign to end terror when we have merely helped light a torch for terror in the minds and hearts of millions who perceive us as unjust in our exercise of power. When I called America the greatest purveyor of violence in the world in the sixties because of our involvement in Viet­nam, I was accused of being unpatriotic. The rest of the country eventually caught up to my stance on that issue, it's safe to say. But the seeds of violence and empire we then sowed halfway cross the world have germinated in the soil of people in the Middle East who have felt for a long time the pressures of American empire. Let me be clear: I do not at all condone the terrorist activity of any group, for any reason, under any circumstances, even as I understand a people's or country's desperation to be released from the yoke of visible and invisible oppressions. If America is going to successfully fight terror, it must do what black folk who were fighting terror in the sixties did: we purged ourselves morally; we examined our own habits to make sure we weren't contributing unnecessarily to violence; we sought divine leadership in our pursuit of truth and justice; and we appealed to the consciences of our oppressors, while refusing to demonize them in the process of demanding fair treatment before the law. Amer­ica is dealing with a dangerous threat to her borders, but she must never capitulate to blind violence and wholesale demonizing of people who have felt the crushing blows of the despotic American will across time. Since most Amer­icans are ignorant of the tragic consequences of our foreign policy, the hatred we face as a nation comes as a surprise. But in fighting terror, we must also fight the impulse to be self-righteous and arrogant; we should practice a bit more humility, which might go a far longer distance in getting the sort of justice and balance and security we need—and that we need to guarantee for others as well.

QUESTION: I know we're running out of time, but your quick take on three subjects: hip hop, Barack and Oprah!

KING: My goodness, what a magnificent trio of issues. Of course, I am quite critical of the violence and misogyny at the heart of so much rap music. I oppose violence in all forms, and I can't offer rap music a pass because it's made by black youth, mostly in our urban centers. But the terri­ble pain I face in listening to the misogyny in rap is that it is the child of our neglect as older, wiser black people.

I remember once when a young lady was brought to the SCLC, complaining of being fairly ravaged by a staffer, and the men gathered there, including me, I'm ashamed to say, were cruelly insensitive to her complaints. We men have been nurtured in a male supremacist society where the needs and claims of women are at best marginal. I was

a chauvinist to my wife for many, many years, and it caused a great deal of strain in our relationship, until I had to finally admit that my ways had to be reformed. It was a difficult process, and I suppose you could say I'm a recov­ering male supremacist. It's hard to see yourself as an oppressor on gender when you've been oppressed by race, but it's a truth we've got to face nonetheless.

That's not to say I don't like rap music; in fact, aside from its vicious sexism and misogyny—and these are words we had no idea about when we fought racism in the sixties—I like the powerful stories and incredible lyrical genius of some of the young folk in rap music. I think at their best they have done what the black pulpit has too many times relinquished doing: telling the ugly truth about painful realities that demand brutal honesty in cor­recting. And if we can forgive sexist, lecherous preachers for their sexual sins—and you can include me in that number, unfortunately—then we can certainly hold our youth accountable while not doing it from a vague, abstract sense of superior morality that won't stand up under even the slightest scrutiny.

As for Barack Obama, I think he's a wonder of nature. I said in the sixties that we hadn't yet produced in black circles a political personality that had the magnetism and respect of John F. Kennedy. I think we may have found that person in Senator Obama. He is incredibly well- prepared, very bright, very thoughtful, and not full of bombast—though by nature, every politician has to brag about what he or she has done, or will o, to lead the country. The thought of having such a worthy person in the highest office is simply wonderful. And the sheer charisma and magnetism that he brings revives a sense of expectation and hope in the electorate, and that's a stun­ning thing to witness coming from a black man whose people in the South couldn't even vote for the most part until the mid-sixties. I do caution people, however, in expecting too much from Senator Obama should he become president. A black president won't stop black suffering, but he can use his bully pulpit to speak out on social issues that matter to us, and he can help enact legis­lation that will address our most pressing needs—like universal healthcare, tax cuts for the poorest and neediest, not the richest Americans, and jobs and boosted wages for the working class and poor. But the need for prophets outside the system won't disappear with a black president. We must hold him accountable just as we would any other president. Now that would be a sign of real racial progress: to witness a black president engaged in his duties while facing serious scrutiny by prophetic black voices in the culture. Finally, I am the world's biggest fan of Oprah Winfrey. I think she is a stunning figure, a woman who best repre­sents our people's magnificent spiritual genius. Oprah's show, and her sparkling, luminous presence in the world, has done more good than a million sermons and acts of Congress. Her will to better the American people by offer­ing an alternative to smut media is remarkable and coura­geous. Her support for the black poor in this country when it wasn't even popular has been stirring. Her loving embrace of our brothers and sisters in Africa has been nothing short of miraculous. She is the symbol of our will to survival through the word and spirit translated into therapeutic doses of information and transformed moral habits that provide her the most powerful pulpit in the world today. I applaud her sterling and impeccable sense of conscience, and her refusal to do anything to tarnish the black moral treasury and integrity with which she has been endowed. She has proved that white America can listen to a black voice that resonates with pure love and extraordinary compassion for the ordinary human being.

I must say, I love Oprah.